The situation for Christians in Afghanistan was dire even before the United States began withdrawing its military from the country last month.
According to the World Watch List, which ranks countries based on the amount of religious persecution, Afghanistan landed as #2, only behind North Korea. The Center for the Study of Global Christianity wrote that less than 3 percent of people in Afghanistan personally know a Christian.
To help give us context about the situation in Afghanistan, Hannah Chao, editor at the SOLA Network, interviewed Scott Oh, pastor at Rooftop Church in Break, California. Scott used to help operate an orphanage in Afghanistan from 2004-2007, and he still has contacts in the country.
We hope this interview will give us new insights into the people of Afghanistan and encourage us to pray for the people there.
Editor’s Note: Below is a rough transcript of the interview. Please excuse any errors. It has been edited for clarity. You can listen to the audio here.
Hannah Chao: Hello, everyone. Welcome to SOLA Network. My name is Hannah Chao, and I’m an editor here. And today we’re having a conversation with Pastor Scott Oh, who is at Rooftop Church. He’s going to share with us about Afghanistan as he has worked there and has a great heart for the country. So Scott, why don’t you go ahead and introduce yourself.
Scott Oh: Hello, everyone. Hello, SOLA. My name is Scott. I’m a local church pastor here in the city of Brea, California. My church and I have been here about four years.
I’d like to share about my time in Afghanistan. I lived in Afghanistan for three years, dating all the way back to 2004 to 2007. At that time, I was commissioned by my then-home church to serve at an orphanage in a city in Afghanistan. My biggest project was to oversee the orphanage building project.
We were housing about 30 Afghan orphans, and the project was to build a bigger facility and house up to 120-150 Afghan orphans in the region that I was living in. However, my time was cut short because of a terrorist attack by the Taliban in the month of July of 2007.
I’m not sure if you guys are aware, but there was a kidnapping incident that involved 23 South Koreans. There were short-term workers that were commissioned, and they were captured by the Taliban, and unfortunately, two of them ended up being executed. So because of that incident, many missionaries of the South Korean nationality were forced out within just months of that time.
At that time, I wasn’t an American citizen; I was a South Korean citizen. I was actually in Dubai, and I had a short-term team with me, ready to enter Afghanistan. But the incident happened while we were waiting in Dubai, so I was denied entrance. So what should have been a one-month furlough ended up being indefinite. I was never able to go back and return to the land of Afghanistan. I just found out recently that many kids at the orphanage that I was working with with my wife never got a full clarification of what occurred. That’s my experience of how my time was, and that is my connection with Afghanistan.
Hannah Chao: So we know that Afghanistan has been going through turmoil. The U.S. military just finished pulling out its troops, and we know the Taliban has taken over the government. From watching the news and keeping in touch with people there, what is the current situation in Afghanistan both for the people and for Christians?
Scott Oh: Like you, I’m trying to gather as much information or as many resources as possible through different media outlets. As outsiders looking in, we are curious of what is going to happen. We are fearful of what might happen.
But when I talk to the people in Afghanistan, the reaction is quite different in the sense that the fear of the Afghan people is not so much of the unknown, but rather the known. You have to understand that these people have lived through the Taliban regime nearly two decades ago. It’s a really brutal regime where daily life is filled with unbearable tension. We’re talking about regular public executions, oppression for women, and everyone living in the entire land of Afghanistan fearing that knock at the door that could come anytime any day. They would just heap greater suffering onto the general population. It’s so I would say, the fear and the tension is at its highest right now.
Hannah Chao: What about for Christians? I know Afghanistan doesn’t have a lot of Christians in the population, but they are there. So what is it like for them?
Scott Oh: I don’t know the exact numbers, but I remember the statistics years back, and I think those numbers still hold quite true. So Afghanistan’s population is 99.7% Muslim. So that’s less than .3% that is comprised of different religions. And Christianity is probably the greatest minority religion there; the last research I did is anywhere from 10,000 to 12,000. Christians.
Like most other countries that ban Christianity, every single one of these Christians gathers in underground churches, and even underground churches probably do not have larger corporate gatherings where they can freely express and worship God. It’s very hidden. And even during my time, nearly two decades ago, I had seen very few Christians. Even in my own context and ministry, the number of converts I worked with was very little. So we are talking about an extreme minority in that land
What I’m hearing through different podcasts and news is that unlike the anxiety that Christians all over the world have concerning the Christians in Afghanistan, they’re doing quite well. Their spirits are high. They’re very glad for the opportunity to continue to worship God and to be faithful in their lives. In fact, they’re urging the Christians all over the world to be even stronger in our places of faith, and continue to lift them up—not lessening of persecution, but greater power so that they may overcome what they’re seeing over there.
But my contacts there are not Christians. My contacts right now are former kids that we did help raise when they were much younger when my wife and I left the compound. We housed kids from ages ranging from 3 to 14, and two in particular that we were able to get in contact with. They’re now 22 and 26 so much has changed. It’s just really surreal to hear from them. what their experiences are like.
Hannah Chao: Are they continuing to work with the orphanage? Or are they just trying to survive under the Taliban? What’s it like for those people that you know in Afghanistan?
Scott Oh: In 2007 I was denied entrance, so my successor had continued to work. But even that operation had to be folded completely around 2012. We had surrendered the orphanage building to the government, and it became a government-run orphanage. Many of the kids were returned to their distant relatives because they didn’t have both sets of parents.
I’ll share two stories and two kids. One, we’ll call him Daniel for security reasons. He was able to eventually work for the Korean embassy. Shortly after I had left, my successor created an opportunity because he was one of the oldest boys—his time was coming near where he would eventually have to leave the compound. So he worked three years at the embassy. According to him, he was washing dishes, washing clothes, and his main occupation was to make life easier for the government workers.
Thankfully, one of the contacts that he had made at that time remembered him. So when this ordeal happened, and when the Korean government was planning this rescue operation—give them some credit. According to my contact Daniel, they were doing this at least a couple of months prior to the actual incident where the Taliban completely took over. So he was fortunate enough to be added to that list, and he and his wife were granted traveling documents.
As you would have seen in the news and the video clips on the internet, he made his way to the airport, and he and six other families were kind of waiting and camping outside. He had wrote down on a piece of cardboard box, “Korea.” He said he just paced back and forth, back and forth, where other government workers would see the Afghans waiting for some kind of response and help.
About three hours of doing that, he was waved in by the Korean workers, and he showed his documentation. He was one of the 390 people that boarded the plane, and now he’s in Korea, staying safely in a hotel for 14-day quarantine. I don’t think he has ever left the country prior to this. In fact, I know for sure that he had never been on an airplane either. So that’s his first experience.
We’ve been video chatting, and his wife, who was seven months pregnant, is dealing with the change in scenery, the change in food, and now, they have no idea what tomorrow holds, except they’re going day by day at a time with announcements and the information that’s given to them.
Hannah Chao: Wow. You said you had another story you wanted to share?
Scott Oh: So that’s the fortunate story. So I’m really happy for Daniel.
Another story that I wanted to tell is about a girl named Jenny. She’s been reaching out to us for the past few days quite aggressively—I think every night, I don’t think she’s aware of the time difference either. But for her, she’s pretty much trapped not only in her city but also trapped in her home.
Because of the reality of what the Taliban might do, she has not really left the house for any reason. And in fact, her older brother and her dad, who are the breadwinners of the family, they’ve also come home and are reluctant to leave the house because of the fear of what might happen.
You have to understand: the Taliban are bad, bad people, and they’re notorious. They have no regard for your safety or well-being. They’re completely unpredictable but also predictable in the sense that because we have seen what they have done. So she spends all of her time at home.
She keeps asking, like, Is there anything, you know, Koko, which means uncle, “Koko, can you do something? Can you do anything? We have spent time together in the past. Can you tell your friends and your government to help me get out of this country?”
Unfortunately, Hannah, they don’t really know the reality of the US pulling out? You know, they don’t really know. And no one’s really telling them that it’s because, for the past 20 years, no significant progress has been made, and those are the reasons or what have you. All they’re thinking is, “There’s bad people affecting our lives and destroying our lives, and we don’t feel safe. Why isn’t anyone doing anything about this?”
It’s really heartbreaking and, and for me, I’m frustrated. And I’m so sad because it’s not just Jenny. There are so many people. I’m getting messages from my former driver asking the same thing: Can you get me out of this country? I say I can’t do anything. This morning, the message came saying, “Well, what if I got to Iran? What if I ran away to Pakistan?” Either would involve him risking his life. “What if I got to those countries—then would you be able to get me out?”
The people that are inside the country of Afghanistan right now, they’re living with uncertainty. Their lives are not promised. Many of them don’t know if they would live or for how long.
Hannah Chao: Could you share with us ways we could pray for Afghanistan? Do you have any things that you would want us to put at the top of the list?
Scott Oh: We had a prayer meeting with my church folks last night. We dedicated our monthly prayer gathering to praying for Afghanistan, and I shared these four things, and it’ll be really quick.
First and foremost, my prayers are for the safety of all civilians, particularly women. and I mentioned to you that living under the regime of the Taliban: it’s terrible; it’s unbearable. But from my experience and talking to the Afghan people, it’s far worse for women. If you’re between the ages of 16 to 40, you’re living with a constant fear that you can be snatched away from your own family and be forced into marriage into terrible things, and their lives are not going to be guaranteed. So first and foremost, you can pray for the safety of all Afghan people.
Second, for the Taliban to be eradicated and completely removed from any power or any influence in the land of Afghanistan. I personally think they’re the equivalent of the Nazis where they’re not to be trusted. They’re not to be handed any kind of power over any region, any city or any particular place in the world.
Also, pray for the Christians to continue to persevere in their faith. Again, there are about 10,000-12,000 people. Apparently, the Taliban have a list of these Christians. So they’re coming after them, and they’re going to be hot on their pursuit. But I really do believe that in the same way that we have seen in the New Testament (particularly the book of Acts) the persecution in Jerusalem and the nearby cities, it drove the Christians outside to evade out of the safety of their own lives. But that’s exactly what caused the growth of the Christian church in other greater areas all over Europe and Asia. So I’m praying that as these Christians are being persecuted and persevere in faith, I know that God will continue to advance his kingdom.
Fourth and last, I want to say, for those that have the power or have the ability to relieve the suffering in that land to move swiftly and wisely, and powerfully. I don’t know what country that is. I don’t know what organization or group of people. But if I understand how God works throughout time, God always uses people. There are always agents that he uses in delivering from suffering and relieving suffering all throughout the land. So I’m praying for four of those things.
Hannah Chao: Thank you so much for sharing those. Those are concrete prayer requests that we can bring up to God, whether individually or with our churches or with our community groups. Is there anything else you want to just share or exhort our SOLA listeners and readers about Afghanistan?
Scott Oh : The opportunity came to me in 2003 or 2004, when I had committed my life to serve God overseas. The clear voice from God that came to me was just to go and serve the church. The highest agenda item for the church at the time happened to be Afghanistan, and I went. I know in the same way that these stories and what you’re seeing in that country may inspire some of you. I pray that if you can commit the time, obviously none of us can go now, but begin committing your time and continue to learn about what’s going on there.
Also, I received another message from a Facebook friend—we’re not even that close—but because he has seen my post about Afghanistan, he connected me to an individual that is now going to work with Afghan refugees that are going to be placed in somewhere Orange County, so they’re collecting clothes and some necessary items for life. There will be ways where you can help and your church community can help. So as someone who shares deeper connections with Afghanistan, it would be wonderful if there are more of you joining us in that endeavor.
Hannah Chao: Thank you so much for sharing, Scott. We’ll be praying for the Afghan people, the country, and finding ways to support our brothers and sisters there too. Thank you so much.