Episode 2: Raising the Next Generation, and Academics

Welcome to Asian American parenting, a podcast from Rooted Ministry and the SOLA Network, where the gospel meets Asian American faith culture and parenting. Each episode, we explore how to raise the next generation with a strong gospel foundation in Christ while navigating the unique challenges of our cultural identity. Thanks for joining us. Let’s dive in. 

Danny Kwon: Welcome. I’m Danny Kwon, a co host. I’m Rooted’s Senior Director of Youth Ministry content and cross cultural initiatives. And before joining Rooted I was a youth pastor for 29 years at one Asian American church. And this is my co host, co host Monica Kim, my wife, who’s also a biblical counselor and psychologist whose PhD work specialized in parenting and attachment theory, say, Hello, Monica. 

Monica Kim: Hi everyone. 

Danny Kwon: And Monica, I know you were a great co servant with me in our church ministry, so I appreciate that. And today, in our second episode, we’re going to continue kind of our introduction in this idea of what is gospel centered parenting and Asian American parenting. I mean, eventually we are going to get into some specific topics, like academics and Asian American this in the Gospel Asian Americanness and future jobs for our children, and how we think about that in our culture and Faith Asian Americanness and how we nurture our children’s talents versus how we nurture them in their faith in the Lord, parenting anxieties versus the gospel, and how our Asian American faith has a impact on That being raised in the first and second generation churches, and how that impacts our Gospel centered parenting and the slew of other issues. 

But today, we wanted to continue again in a little bit of our introduction to this topic of what is gospel centered parenting. In the Asian American church, we talked about the intersection of faith, culture and parenting. And for me, I often think about Judges, 210, where it says and all the generation were gathered to their fathers, and there arose another generation after them who did not know the Lord or work that he had done for Israel. So me and you, Monica, we go to church. We were raised in faith by our first generation parents who did not speak English. Went to a church that was not English speaking. They were immigrants, but we went to church. Were raised up in our faith. And you know, when I think about our kids, and I think about the third generation in this verse from judges, 210, and there arose another generation after them who did not know the Lord you know, and from Joshua’s generation to what happened in Judges 210 it’s always kind of a sobering reminder of Asian American parents, of maybe some of our Asian American influences, of culture, of parenting that might influence our faith and our view of the gospel and how we raise our kids, you know, I know for first generation parents, because they didn’t speak the American English language, they gathered at church, and faith was kind of a social center. Of their lives, but was also a faith center of their lives. But for second generation parents like us, you know we’re in ministry. So you know we go to church, but sometimes, you know the influences of culture have lessen the impact of faith. Any any thoughts on that?

Monica Kim: Yeah, the influence of culture, but also the influence of maybe even our first generation church culture, yeah, maybe all of those may have impacted how we might prioritize the emphasis on serving the Lord and and passing that down to our generations generations after that. Yeah, I also think about, I think just when you were talking about judges, the passage in Judges, and I think sometimes what we also lose is the priority of the gospel in our lives and this, and I’m not, I’m not using this passage to like we don’t want to. It’s not about fearing people to believe, right, but the priority of the gospel above and beyond anybody’s culture, even as it intersects it, right? Because the gospel that did come into, you know, the Bible often, is about speaking into culture, in every culture, from the Old Testament kind of and reshaping it and reorienting the particular cultural context in which the Scripture is spoken into, God’s word is spoken into. But what for me comes to mind is the challenge of the passage, even in Mark chapter eight, for thinking about our parenting and how we ought to, you know, think about our children when it says in verse 36 for what does it profit A man to gain the whole world and forfeit his soul. Hm, it’s, it’s, it’s a sobering I think you know word of you know Jesus as he was speaking to you know the crowd and his disciples, that about following after Jesus and being a disciple. 

Danny Kwon:  Yea, so there’s two things on that, like as a youth and family pastor for 29 years and seeing parents like us, second gen parents, you know, sometimes, unfortunately, we’ve maybe lost the biblical calling, Deuteronomy six, Proverbs 22, Ephesians six of discipling, our kids. That’s, that’s for all cultures, not just Asian culture, but, you know, because we’re, you know, in some ways, children of immigrants and our parents lived, you know, in poverty and they had to work 16 hour days, and you know, so we, you know, and we had to go to college in America, and you know, had to, you know, you know, succeed in some way. You know, we want that for our own kids. You know, as Asian Americans, we want our kids to, you know, you read Mark eight, what good it is for to inherit the whole world but forfeit his soul. But sometimes that’s what we kind of yeah unintentionally, or live out to our kids as Asian American parents. 

Monica Kim: And again, just emphasizing what you said, it’s, you know, in all different cultures where that’s happening, yeah, the Gospel priority gets lost by the social, cultural, historical kind of mandates or the pressures around us, and there are particular ways in which the Asian American context or community might grapple with that that’s a little different from. That’s a mainstream culture too, in the sense that, as you already mentioned, you know, prioritizing the gospel in the midst of historical generational, country origin of country trauma, along with immigration, along with, you know, acculturation challenges, to orient oneself to such a different culture and parent the children. 

Then there’s also for, let’s say, second or even third generational Asian Americans, the social particular kind of cultural milieu might involve trying to make sense of, you know, the disconnect with our parents and then feeling much more of the pressures and not understanding, you Know, and being, you know, being really so disconnected that you have such a hard time understanding and you feel like you’re you’re without your parents support to navigate so many, you know, adjustments that you have to make as immigrant children and etcetera, etcetera, you know, so many kind of social, cultural, historical, kind of context to navigate that will often take us away from this gospel hope And, you know, orientation to be able to grasp onto, and yeah, that’s what we’re trying to get to. How do, how do parents, in the midst of all those layers as Asian Americans, where we have had so many kind of barriers or even challenges or hardship that are unique to us that make the gospel call for discipling our children and prioritizing faith on this side of heaven come to bear. What would that look like?

Danny Kwon: So as a, as a as a psychologist, your PhDs in parenting and attachment, and you know, also as a biblical counselor, like, where is the the tension and balance of you know, what good Is it to inherit the whole world and forfeit his soul that we’re not living out the biblical calling to raise our kids in faith, and we’re more stressing their Success and their SAT scores and their grades, and you know that faith takes a second very seat to in their lives.

Monica Kim: And in some cases, maybe faith is the also the driver to succeeding too, using faith to drive the success. Sometimes it can almost sometimes feel like that in the Asian American context too. Having said that, in terms of the that tension I as you, I would, I would not want to say it is an either or, because the Gospel comes into our culture and really breaks through and reorients us. So it’s not like we become culture less, cultureless people, and somehow we just kind of, you know, flattens out and flatten out the gospel. Gospel is so powerful to speak into help us to reflect and examine from where we’ve come and how we can be, how we can dig deep into finding the comfort and the hope of the gospel that reorients us to really in the midst of our everyday, lived kind of living circumstances, to be able to continue to look to the cross and the resurrection again and again in so many different ways, in the various everyday crevices of. Parenting life with our children, Asian Americans, yeah,

Danny Kwon: So like, let’s just take the topic of academic success. And you know, we want our kids to do well academically, but when does it cross over into sin that we’re pushing them so hard, or we’re just obsessing over them as parents that, you know, we we only seem to care about academic success, or, you know, it becomes the priority. You know, you can miss church on Sunday because you have a, you know, business leaders club or sports or band or something. 

Monica Kim: Yea, especially since that is also a huge cultural value, yeah, education such a huge cultural value that if you don’t have education, then you know, You know, then it’s hard to do much right in terms of that, that question, how does it teeter into, you know, idolatry and sin, or when is it too much? I don’t think it’s also like one size fits all, in the sense that there are so many kind of facets to it, or nuances to consider. I think there is the call for all of us as parents who need to reflect on recognizing that in our culture, education has taken such a priority, you know, that we do need to reflect on our hearts before the Lord ourselves and wonder, have we, how have we prioritized that as our, you know, saving in place of the saving grace of God? Because think of that as a way to save our family or you know, or survive or succeed, right from our sense that a fear of being no more, so if we think about that being something important to reflect On that be that’s really important. 

Another part is just, you know, we’ll probably go into a little bit more in later episodes also. But as another kind of, you know, a thing to think about is sometimes when we, you know, education for children, for our kids, it’s not a bad thing, right? Our culture, in our world, in the US today, really, every child goes to school and it it’s supposed to be a really good thing to to have access to education, which is really important. It is a something that, you know, God has given to us. So that is a good thing, too. In the midst of that good though, sometimes we might also miss out our children and how they have been given specific kind of talents, maybe even areas where they excel, but also areas they may not be as good in. Sometimes we want to fit them into this mold that they have to be excellent at everything. And if we start to do that, and you know, we become very anxious if our kids don’t excel in one area, but they do in another. Some parents might start to become very anxious, because we’re all also many thinking about well they have to do well overall in order to get to a certain kind of college where we again, we so value education. Yeah, that kind of college they get to is so important to us. So there are so many facets to reflect on and consider that. Are we then trying to mold our children without thinking about that, how God has created them to be and getting to know them and foster, you know, their talents, for the glory of God. How do we love them? The Lord, with their talents, we may actually even miss that out. Sometimes, those are just two things you know, that comes to mind when we’re when you ask that question about education and specific. Where can it, you know, flip or where can it get challenged, and we don’t see the gospel in the midst of it.

Danny Kwon: So you know, you might have a family. Might have a child who’s excellent academically, but then might have a child that does not just academically incline, but has different gifts and talents in different ways, yeah, and to be able to really nurture and recognize that. 

Monica Kim: And that’s why, in the midst of those differences, uh, the hope of the gospel gives us so much more hope for all of these diverse, very different kind of ways of being and living, as opposed to the more restrictive mandate of whether it is our cultural, you know, value as Asian Americans, but also the cultural value as it intersects even the challenges of living in a society that we often feel are, you know, we often feel like we’re perpetual foreigners, too. And so there are so many aspects that, you know, pressure us to be more but the gospel can free us from that pressure to be more like

Danny Kwon: How do we know how much we need to help and nurture and even push our kids academically? And I’ll just use that example, since we’re talking about it versus we’re doing too much. We’re pushing too much. Maybe they’re not academically inclined, or, you know, we’re exasperating them, as Ephesians six says, and we’re provoking them to anger, and we’re, you know, making them hate Jesus in my youth pastor vernacular. 

Monica Kim: You know, like especially parents say you’re going to do it for the glory of God. Yeah, we pressure them. It’s too much, right? How do you know? Going back to that question, I think it, yeah, it’s also you’re probably, you know, we’ll, we’ll probably be talking about this over and over again, that it’s, it’s not like such a simple answer, yeah, you actually know, right? But it is about a journey and gaining wisdom on getting to know your children and their unique not only talents, but also ability to experience the pressure, and then to be able to withstand it too. You know that is also very different, different kind. The teenagers will have such different ability to be able to withstand that too. And if I think about my three children, you know, each are so different.

Danny Kwon: Our three children, yeah, our three children, yeah. They were teenagers.

Monica Kim: They responded so differently to the pressure right to say, hey, and mind you, we were also having to, as parents, reflect on where’s our heart in the midst of, you know, encouraging or or, you know, calling them out to to continue to grow, let’s say, in their academic, you know, abilities we had to really think about our hearts, but also think about each of the teenagers that we’ve had and the way in which God gave them various talents, but also various abilities to experience the call or the the pressure to to do things academically, and how to then give them the support, but also how to to relent when needed to. There are so many kind of facets that I know we’d have to think about as parents in light of, you know, when is it too much, and when it is it not enough to.

Danny Kwon: And you know, for an immediate next episode, I think this idea that you’re alluding to is, you know, you. You say this a lot, and I know you’ve gotten it from others, connection before correction, you know, connecting with your child before correcting them, challenging them, yeah, or challenging them. But because we’ve been influenced in Asian American confusion hierarchy. How does you know maybe as a parent, I need to flush that out in my life and recognize where that confusion ethic is pervasive in me versus the gospel, and I need to be more connection before correction.

Yeah, just something very interesting, yeah, yeah. It’s a very interesting topic, yeah. So before we go and we think about our next episode, I do want to end with a little bit of a lighter question so the audience can continue to get to know you and I. And last time, we talked about our most cherished moment from our teenage years. And so this time, what is the most horrible or terrible memory from your teenage years, and I’ll go first this time for me, I got into Three solid universities, but I was rejected from seven others, all the Ivy Leagues. I applied to all the top schools, and so I just remember how terrible of a memory it was back then you were actually mailed your acceptance or rejection letters from college. And I remember seven days in a row getting letters of rejection from college, and it was really sad. I wrote about this in a book that rooted wrote Jesus, I wish I knew for the Asian American teenager and how I felt so shameful, even though my parents didn’t make me feel shameful, and I didn’t come home from college for two years because I didn’t get into an Ivy League school, and so that’s kind of one of My most terrible memories from high school. How about you? Monica. 

Monica Kim: My most difficult memory in high school, or when I was a teenager, was in high school. I was, you know, volleyball player. And at that time, you know, given that I was a I was a setter. 

Danny Kwon: And you were MVP of your team. 

Monica Kim: Yes, I did get that. And at the same time, in my last year, I started to develop some anxieties. It was pretty, pretty intense, and I didn’t know how to manage it. I didn’t even know that I was suffering from it. But what had happened was I just felt I just couldn’t play anymore. I quit. Yeah, it was really, really hard and a tough memory. Just look back and thinking and think, gosh, if I had a little bit more support in my last year of you know, I and I understood a little bit more about how, how deeply anxious I was, and to be able to face it with that kind of incursion and support. 

Danny Kwon: Yeah, and that’ll be a future topic for Our for this Asian American parenting this podcast, because, uh, mental health and Asian American culture and faith and how, even from our parents generation to our generation, how we view mental health and mental health treatment and things like That, I think that’ll be an important episode that we revisit. But until next time for our listeners, we want to encourage you to subscribe to the podcast Asian American parenting, and we look forward to episode three next time. Time, and until then, may we embrace the hope and joy of the Gospel and believe that it’s true, powerful and transformative for our personal lives and for our lives and our parents and teenagers. Thank you for listening. Bye, bye. We hope that you have enjoyed this podcast for more resources, visit the show notes, see you next time.