On Friday, President Donald Trump said that churches were essential and called on governors to allow them to reopen them. In addition, earlier this month, a group of California pastors announced that they would reopen their doors on May 31, whether or not they had government permission. This decision is part of a larger discussion surrounding how churches should function during the pandemic.
(Editor’s Note: This interview was recorded before President Trump’s announcement, so they do not comment on his remarks.)
To discuss whether or not churches should reopen, SOLA Editorial Board member Daniel K. Eng moderated a Zoon discussion between three Californian lead pastors — Thomas Hwang from Gospel Life Mission Church, P.J. Tibayan from Bethany Baptist Church in Bellflower, and Hanley Liu from First Chinese Baptist Church in Walnut.
During this conversation, they talk about what it means to love their neighbors, submit to authority, and religious freedom. We hope this conversation will spark healthy discussions within your church as we weather this pandemic together.
Here are some highlights from the conversation:
Thomas Hwang, Lead Pastor at Gospel Life Mission Church:
In Acts 5, when the Apostle Peter was proclaiming the gospel and [Chrsitians] were told by the Pharisees to stop doing what they’re doing, Peter responds saying, “We must obey God rather than man.” Clearly, there are certain points where even though we want to obey the government, like in Romans 13 where Paul tells us to do submit to them, there are certain points when the government violates what God’s will is for the church. [Then] we should consider not necessarily following what the government is ordering us to do.
I think a lot of people are almost situating it in an Acts 5 versus Romans 13 situation And I just don’t know that’s the right framework to look at the situation because it does seem like right now it’s primarily for safety. And so the best framework I saw was The New York Times article that talks about [how for] Christians, this is our way of loving our neighbors — by staying home at this current moment. So that’s the lens that [with which] we’re interpreting the situation right now.
Hanley Liu of First Chinese Baptist Church in Walnut:
At least in California, we don’t see the government as targeting the church – asking us to dissolve or preventing us from preaching the gospel. And so when we consider Romans 13, and 1 Peter 2, where Peter tells the Christians in the New Testament to submit to the emperor, we see that what’s happening at least right now here in California is very different.
We’re encouraged to stream the gospel to preach the gospel together online, and the institution is not being asked to dissolve. This is also different from places in East Asia, where if we try to Get the gospel out the way we do through media, you’d be arrested, pastors would be arrested, and churches are asked to dissolve. So at this point, we are going to try our best to follow the government’s order.
In East Asia, there’s a clear anti-Christian, anti-religious kind of government. It is closer to Nero, where the Roman government is saying no, you need to bow down to our regime and you need to bow down to the Emperor. So I think [our situation] is very different.
P.J. Tibayan from Bethany Baptist Church in Bellflower:
Everyone wants to obey God, and God gave the church a certain authority to exercise the keys of the kingdom (Matthew 16 and18), and part of it is gathering — that’s part of our discipleship.
At the same time, God instituted the government. The government is not man’s idea. Now the government is not always right or always good. But just like there’s parental authority, and church authority, there’s government authority. Those are three God-given authorities that are that can be abused, but can also be used rightly.
Sometimes I’m hearing [this discussion] framed as church versus government and [figuring out] which one is a higher authority. But it’s not an issue of higher authority. It’s an issue of jurisdiction. The hard thing about this discussion about the church meeting together is that there’s an overlap of where the church has the authority to gather and disciple and where the government has authority, based on Genesis 9 to preserve life by not gathering together to spread a virus. If people really are dying from it, the government has that obligation. And so we’re kind of stuck in the middle of those two jurisdictions.